Jacques Attali on sugar, fossil fuels and the positive economy

The economist Jacques Attali was special adviser to former French president Françoise Mitterrand and became the first president of the European Bank for Reconstruction and Development, which he left amid controversy after only two years. He went on to set up Positive Planet, a non-profit organisation that advocates for the creation of a ‘positive economy’ and supports entrepreneurs across France, Africa and the Middle East.

Q: Why do we need organisations like Positive Planet if sustainability is something government and business can address?

A: We need first to create clear concepts of what defines a positive society. It can be a nation, a company or a family that takes care of the interest of future generations. It should be sustainable across all dimensions that will be useful to future generations.

In order to have a positive society, we need to focus on the economic sectors that can help meet that goal. The pandemic has clearly shown our existing gaps: education, healthcare, sustainable agriculture, digital logistics, sustainable finance and insurance, among others.

You need non-governmental organisations to help evangelise about these needs, and to monitor what companies and countries do.

Q: You also believe that the world needs to part ways with sugar as much as it does with fossil fuels. Does it?

A: Sugary drinks, fast foods, but also pastries — sugar is everywhere and it is killing people through obesity, diabetes and other diseases. It is one of the world’s poisons, next to fossil fuels. If you look at oil and gas companies and their related sectors, like transportation, plastics, textiles, packaging, and the sectors linked to sugar, you have more than 50 per cent of the world’s GDP. To have real growth, we need to focus elsewhere — on the sectors that the pandemic has shown are lacking.

Q: How do you change this, what motivates the people in power to change?

A: What will force them to change is the fact that there will otherwise be no future for mankind. Of course, people are very short-sighted. So all of us need to be very demanding of our leaders, to push them in the right direction: as consumers, savers, citizens and voters.

To use a football analogy, if you’re a spectator, you can either feel optimistic or pessimistic about the game you are watching; as a player, you have a different perspective: to win. We are not spectators of mankind, we are mankind. And I think we have the capacity to win this, if we do it right.